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Joe_Cavalry All Day Every Day


Debate Info

60
29
Yes No, their women like it
Debate Score:89
Arguments:52
Total Votes:92
More Stats

Argument Ratio

side graph
 
 Yes (30)
 
 No, their women like it (22)

Debate Creator

joecavalry(39995) pic



Is it sexist for Muslim men to force their wives to wear a burka?

Yes

Side Score: 60
VS.

No, their women like it

Side Score: 29
5 points

I believe it is, Woman (No matter what culture they are) should have the right to choose what they want to wear and what they don't. It's equality woman have just as much right as men do to choose.

Side: yes

I am the least sexist person I know. For example, I support the right of women everywhere to wear skimpy clothing. Hell..., I'm even all for women going topless..., like men. Man, I love equality ;)

Side: yes
1 point

yes there should not be any kind of bar for women to wear clothes of her choice coz its a world of equality

Side: yes
Screechdaman(21) Disputed
1 point

Well in their culture the women wear burkas, and depending how it is interpreted women do have the right to not wear the burka.

Side: No, their women like it

Really? Well..., if you're a woman, try not wearing a burka around the Taliban. ;)

Side: No, their women like it
4 points

The weird situation in the Arab world is a perfect example of backwards thinking, and the effect it has on people. Firstly for some reason or another, the philosophy and perspective of the countries in the Arab world haven't changed much. Now, I'd blame it on their religion, but since other cultures have out-grown some of the strange things in their religion, I can't totally fault it. Secondly, they've always treated their women like that, and there's never been enough of women over there with the drive to stop it. Because you get rocks thrown at you. And you get shot.

It is sexist. It's wrong for them to be doing that, but they don't think it is because it's always been their approach. It's built into their culture which doesn't want to change. There are going to be some more problems the more the rest of the world progresses, in my opinion.

Side: yes

If they have to resort to force, then yes, otherwise no. But the part that gets me is that I want to see what she looks like ;)

Side: yes
3 points

Is it sexist for Muslim men to force their wives to wear a burka?

YES IT IS .

According to one Brittish muslim woman :

'The veil is a tool of oppression used to alienate and control women under the guise of religious freedom' and it should be banned."

'Nowhere in the Koran does it state that a woman's face and body must be covered in a layer of heavy black cloth'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1195052/Why-I-British-Muslim-woman-want-burkha-banned-streets.html#ixzz0f8hz1HzK

Side: yes
3 points

No it is not sexist to make them wear burkas, it is a travesty to Stone them to death for leaving the house with out a Male family member.

Side: yes
3 points

Forcing anyone to do anything against their will is authoritarian and immoral, but not necessarily sexist.

Side: yes
2 points

I think it is sexist.

I mean theirs accounts of women going into public with a burka on and getting beaten because of that.

If that's not sexist what is it?

Just because it may be because of their religion doesn't mean it's not sexist.

Side: yes
2 points

However, it is done out of religious devotion, much like how a sikh wears a turban.

Side: yes

Only if they refuse to wear one themselves. ....... ....... ...... ....... ...... ....

Side: yes
2 points

For something to be sexist it must be an idea, rule or other such thing enforced on a sex solely because they are of said sex. This enforcement clearly falls under that definition, which is applicable whether it's a religious item or not.

Side: yes

You know, I have to agree with you. Those sexist bastards ;)

Side: yes
2 points

Of course, anything forced based on gender is a definition of sexist, so obviously.

A better question would be is it sexist for me to force my gf to wear a nurse uniform on my b-day.

I believe it not to be. No sexism on birthdays.

Side: yes
2 points

The keyword in this argument is "force."

Men and women, speaking strictly in correlation with the way I see it, are equal. Men and women have different physical traits, their voices are different, sure. However, at the end of the day, they both share one common quality, and that is that they're both human.

Why should one gender have the right to dominate, instruct, and control the other? What gives them the right? Until that is thoroughly, and reasonably justified, it stands that men and women are equal and neither sex is more superior than the other in terms of social equality.

If a woman wants to wear a burka, that is her right. On that same token, she also has just as much a right to decide not to wear a burka. Period.

Side: yes
2 points

it is sexist from a modern not necessary liberal point of view and ultimately it is, meaning that the tradition holds form through the religion which clearly states it believes men to be superior to women (this applies to Christianity as well). i do not think the men we would refer to as sexist comprehend the notion, and i do believe that they mostly do it to gain the highest levels of respect for their women and out of an earnest desire to get all they care about to heaven. NOT ALL MUSLIM MEN FORCE THEIR WIVES TO WEAR BURKAS

Side: Yes and No
1 point

it is very sexiest because they should be able to wear whatever they want. they also should be able to show their whole face to the public without getting beaten for it. They have no rights whatsoever they cant do a dang thing if their husband doesnt know about it they caint do a DANG thing about it!!! if they were to show "embarass"..or something the family thinks is embarrassing to the family then that person will be kicked out of the family or killed.

Side: yes
Tillerman(29) Disputed
1 point

Ah, but what if, in that culture or religion, not wearing a burka is tantamount to running around completely nude?

Would it still be okay then? Or would you propose to force Muslim's to accept that it is not the same as running around nude?

I'm just playing the Devil's advocate. I actually would hate to live in culture that was so rigid with it's women. But it's not my culture, so can I really say?

Side: No, their women like it
RevKristine(209) Disputed
4 points

I spoke to a Muslim man about this only last week. His reply was that it was so men didn't get inflamed with lust and try to rape women. Which came down to the question of self control. Muslim men seem to feel they lack it. They don't understand how anyone could be in the presence of a woman and not want to force themselves upon her. Which then speaks to the morality of such a religion.

I see Muslim women here in QLD and I am so sad for them, the heat and the humidity has to be hell on them, all wrapped up under that black cloth. If they're wearing it out of choice, that's fine, but if they've been forced into it by men, then it's sexist.

Side: yes
Jorgon(3) Disputed
1 point

You are falling into the trap of relativism. Careful there. I happen to believe that basic human rights are universal and have no patience for any culture that suppresses them.

Side: yes
1 point

this is such a stupid thing to talk about because no muslim guy forces his wife to wear burqa she chooses to because he wouldnt have married her if she wouldnt wear it , a muslim guy doesnt try to change nothing about his wife becuase he will love her just the way she is he will try to convince her to wear but he will never force i dont know where you people get that from because if a girl is forced to marry a guy he could care less about what she wears and yes there such things as arranged marriages but muslim man arent that cruel to force their wife for anything.

Side: Yes

What about all the honor killings ;)

Side: Yes
0 points

UHhh Yes. How could it not be?

.......................................................................................................................

Side: yes
4 points

I don't see how the title and the link match. Maybe you could clarify?

If a muslim man forces his wife to wear a burka or traditionaly clothing but he himself wears non-traditional clothing, he is being sexist.

IF however he makes sure he himself is complying to his traditions and makes it so that she does so too, it isn't sexism. You may disagree with it, but it is not sexism.

Most women tend to wear burkas because they want to or because of family pressure. You cannot call this sexism or even wrong just because we don't agree with it or understand it. If the family pressures her to get good grades in school and go to university would you be calling that sexism too?

Our misunderstanding of their society leads us to the words sexism rather than ultra-conservative/right wing.

Side: No, their women like it

Tell me this.

If your husband forced you to be a stay at home mom and house wife, would you call that sexist?

Side: No, their women like it
1 point

Only if he FORCED it. But again that doesn't define sexism. Only authoritarian.

But you know my views on this ;)

Side: No, their women like it
Sulith(508) Disputed
1 point

Tell me this.

If you were a Muslim woman and didn't wear a Burka when you went out in public and you got beaten for it, would that NOT be sexist?

Side: yes
Kinda(1649) Disputed
1 point

Not if muslim men also got beaten up for not having beards longer than a fist.....

There's a difference between sexism and authoritarianism.

Side: No, their women like it
iamdavidh(4856) Disputed
1 point

I disagree because I still believe in individualism even in light of marriage.

ie. It would not be sexist for the woman to decide to wear a burka because she is conservative.

It is sexist if she is forced based on her gender.

As it would be if she forced him based on his gender, but that is less likely.

You assume because someone is something they choose to be something.

The keyword in the debate description though is force

Side: yes

The keyword in the debate description though is force

Correct. The crux of the problem lies in defining the word force. A Muslim woman would say that it is her choice to wear a burka. But..., and this is a big but, if she refuses to wear the burka she is mercifully killed...., wait...., is it a mercy killing or an honor killing.... Whose honor? Damn wacky jihadist sadists.

Side: yes
Kinda(1649) Disputed
1 point

She's not being forced to do anything based on her gender. She's being forced to do it based on her religion/culture.

Side: No, their women like it
2 points

well it is a deeply rooted tradition that there people have adheared to for centuries. 100 years ago it would not have called sexist becuase it was just the way th8ngs were. how has this changed? well i guess in this new world of equality and freedom anything that differs between male/female is viewed as sexist.

Side: No, their women like it
2 points

First of all this question is slanted towards our American ideology. "No, their women like it" being the only "no" option is definitely a slant because one may not believe it to be sexist, but to say that their women like it is an assumption that most of us are unqualified to make and can make one feel that a person choosing this answer is bigoted or racist.

I question if this isn't a liberally created argument as liberals excel at slanting things to make those that disagree with them sound bigoted and close-minded.

MY ANSWER: No because it is religious and/or cultural. Under Religion you do as is right in God's eyes so that your concise will be pure in His sight. Apostolic women cover their head for this very reason. Under Culture, it's accepted as a differentiation between men and women and is accepted in this way.

As far the "forcing" of their women to wear them may or may not be sexist depending on the person. In that culture it is accepted that men, especially husbands have the final say. And due to this constraint, the husband is also held responsible, sometimes not when it actually counts though, to lead the family. If it is considered shameful for a woman not to wear a burka, then for a woman to refuse it may not just affect her, but may also affect her husband's job, the food on their children's table, and the opportunity of their children to succeed as it would be more difficult in some cultures for children of mothers that are considered amoral or indecent. Questions of the children's legitimacy could end up plaguing the family if it is considered bad enough.

In short, it does not necessarily mean the Husband is sexist or that even the community is, but it would definitely mean that whatever the justification for it is sexist. Whether the justification be their religion, culture, or simple law the reason that justifies a husband's authority to force this upon his wife is what is sexist. That sexist justification needs to be challenged if there will be more freedom in that area.

No matter where we are from we all attempt to live day to day. Generally in mankind, we all attempt to make better for our children and loved ones and do not want to see ourselves or those we care about suffer or live worse lives than our own. And sometimes we follow minor unjust laws or traditions as the one asked about above regardless of whether we agree with them for the sake of peace and the betterment of our families.

Side: Yes and No

Yes and No.In one aspect the women chose that religion knowing the rules which include wearing this,it was teh decision.They did not have to marry a musliim man.On the other hand if the Quran does not force them then maybe but isnt this something they should have discussed with there spouse before marriage?

Side: Yes and No
RevKristine(209) Disputed
2 points

Arranged marriage is practiced in a number of countries where Islam is a predominate religion. Thus, some of them probably DID have to marry a Muslim man. Choice is not always available to women.

Side: yes
Kinda(1649) Disputed
2 points

Who said arranged marriage = forced marriage.

There's a difference between the two.

Side: No, their women like it
1 point

Men and woman should have the right to choose what they want to wear and what they don't, eh?

What about the ones that don't want to wear pants!? (:

Side: No, their women like it
1 point

Then so be it. Just make sure they stay away from the kiddies :)

Side: No, their women like it
1 point

this is silly no muslim men force their wives to wear burka they choose it have you seen it with your eyes muslims women being forced to wear burka have you yall are lame

Side: No, their women like it
1 point

For someone on the outside looking in, of course it seems sexist but that's because you're ignorant to the reason of why women should wear the burka. & I don't mean to offend anyone by saying that's ignorant. I'm sure if I wasn't a Muslim woman myself, I would think the same exact thing.

The way I see it, when a man & women get married, the women's beauty is meant for her husband's eyes, no one else's. Why would you want to go out looking all sexy when you already have whoever you want? No man wants other guys checking out his wife while he's standing right beside her. So what exactly is wrong with Muslim men requesting that their wives wear a burka?

P.S. In Islam, forcing anyone to do anything is wrong. If a person does something, they should do it because they want to, not because they are being oppressed.

Side: No, their women like it

Hey..., I've seen some of those women. Believe me..., they don't need a burka ;)

Side: No, their women like it